Next up everybody is Jill Kargman, actress, author, comedian. We are thrilled to welcome Jill today, and so honored that she's part of this. Jill has an interesting story of her own cancer journey. Welcome, Jill Kargman. Jill. This is great that you're here. Yes. Hi, Bill. It's great you're here. Hope to being here. Thanks for being here. First of all, I really want to say, and I've said it before, how grateful we are for your comedy in your books, in social media. [inaudible]. In so many ways, you make people laugh and bring joy to their world, and I for one I'm super grateful. Thank you. That means so much to me. Thank you. While your work means a lot to a lot of other people and we're super grateful. When I was reading about you, Jill, I read that you had had a melanoma journey. I'm sorry about that, but I'm glad to see you're okay. The thing that resonated with me, one reason when I started LessCancer in 2003, there is somebody in my life that was unheard. She was my sister, and I didn't believe that people were listening to her, and in fact, they weren't. There was something about your journey that you had spoken about in an interview, and I was hoping maybe you could share that journey with those health care providers that will be tuning in for continuing medical education credits because I think there are ways that we can help people advocate for themselves in a stronger better way. We see what can happen even with those that are well connected or have resources where it's tough to advocate for yourself. If you don't mind sharing that, that would be great. Not at all. I'm honored to be here and share it. I'm curious, did your sister have a male physician? She did, and she had had pancreatic cancer for some time before she was diagnosed, and it was written off as mental ailment, needed counseling or hysteria. That's okay. That's the word that for me is triggering and sexist and upsetting because the word hysterical is the Greek root, hystera, which means uterus. When I first went to my elderly male physician who is allegedly the best, whatever that means. Definitely resting on his laurels, patients coming in like a factory, and he had a nice enough bedside manner, but I always felt I had my 15 minutes slot. I had a mole that had been bleeding, and every time I got to the shower or the bath, I would towel off, and there would be blood on the towel. I mentioned this to him in my semi-annual checkup, and he said, "Well, you're pregnant. When you're pregnant, everything's bleeding, your gums are bleeding," and I was, "All right, he's not wrong." I had a God complex with doctors, and I just left it at that. I went back six months later, and I said, "That mole is still bleeding," and he took a look on his loop and said, "There's nothing wrong with it at this point, I'd already had my son.'' I said, "Are you sure? Because I'm just freaked out by the whole thing," and he's, "You're being hysterical. I'm telling you it's okay, I've been doing this for 30 years, it's benign." Fast forward six months later, I bring it up again. He dismisses it again, and then I asked for a botox in my 11th because I get very crinkly and wrinkly here. He said, [inaudible] [inaudible]. I didn't want to do my laugh lines because I like my cross feet, but I definitely wanted these taken away. What's horrified at the ask and said, "I am not a scumbag dermatologist. I'm a medical dermatologist, and I don't believe in injecting poison in people's faces, you got to get somebody else to help you with that." I went to this other doctor who was not a scumbag. She's lovely and she's a real dermatologists. She's not some cosmetics person. A she. A she. She shot me up with my tox. Then as I was leaving, she said, "Is there anything else? Do you have any other questions?" I said, "Actually, I do have this mole, and my other doctor who's very reputable, who she knew, all around New York, people knew him. She looked at it and said, "You know what? He's right. It actually looks benign. But if it's bleeding, I would to take it off." I said, "Okay. Great." She take it right off. Two days later, at the time, I was 34, and I had three children. It was pouring sheets of rain, torrential rain, and I'll never forget it. I was pushing the stroller, and my phone rang, and it was her, not a nurse. That's always the bad sign. She said, "Jill, I'm sorry, but I was shocked. I just got your path report, and you have a serious melanoma." It was bigger eyes she got the top of the tumor when she took off the mole, and they listed it stage 3 at Sloan Kettering, I saw the head of tumors, Daniel Coit. I did the injections in my thigh, and they ascertained the size, and I have now a foot-long scar. I mean, it was an extremely scary, unpleasant situation. I connected with Debra Black who founded Melanoma Research Alliance, who wanted to get my story out because I was young for a typical patient with this level of spread. A lot of that is really because I was ignored three times by my doctor. It was able to progress, and when I was on Good Morning America with her, Dr. Mitch Klein, who's wonderful melanoma doctor in New York. If I said "G, good thing I was bain and got the Botox all right, I guess I wouldn't have made it." He said, "You wouldn't have made it 18 months. You would've been gone. " Heart breaking. It spread that rapidly. This other doctor I need to sell it saved my life by just even asking that question. I think that women especially have to trust their instincts, which is hard for me because I'm not a spiritual person. I'm not an, oh, namaste person and I'm not in touch with my body. I don't pray. I put all my faith in doctors. I'm just not one of those people who knows myself that well. I really trust doctors. For those of us who just take a dismissal at face value, it's really worth getting a second opinion. I'm so glad that I wound up doing that and it's essential if you have any lingering doubts to do. I actually think that female doctors not to reverse sexist, but at least in my experience, they understand the use of those words like hysterical are so belittling and offensive and I wouldn't ever hear that from a woman. She was the one who took it seriously and was overly cautious and didn't just kind of chalk it up to new mothers hysteria. Well, we're so grateful that you trusted yourself enough to keep asking. What we hope is that healthcare providers, physicians, nurses will help their patients learn to hit that easy button more frequently so they feel more confident as a patient. One of the reasons we do these continuing medical education programs is because we are helping to educate physicians and healthcare providers to better take care of their patients from a place of prevention, and they're the ones with the credentials, not me. I'm a CSU from Wayne State University in Detroit. I'm not a scientist or a physician. I'm just what everybody wanted. I wanted less cancer. That comes from a place of not just beating cancer, which I'm so glad you did, but to really prevent the suffering that comes with all cancer journeys. That's right. If there's an opportunity to do that, we want to share their stories and your story. It's been critical to this Workshop and we're so grateful that you shared that. No, of course and Billy, you might not be a physician, but you're still saving lives because you're getting this conversation. I think it's so important because it will inspire patients to advocate for themselves and get second opinions. It might help doctors think twice and say, "Would I say that to a man? Would I use that kind of language with a male patient?" I think if the answer is no, it's worth rethinking how you approach. The delivery might be different, especially if it's a pregnant woman who might have other things going on. But I think it's so careful to tease apart the actual symptoms from maybe the delivery that could come from a place of nervous anxiety. Right. I've always believed the anxiety is a problem. That there's something that drives that. Why your physician wasn't very helpful in the beginning, your second one was and listened to you. All patients deserve to be listened to. Public health often can be remedied by policies. We spend a lot of time educating legislators. It's been an interesting journey this last chunk of years to do so. The sponsor, actually National Cancer Prevention Day, which I founded is Steve Israel who's from New York. He's always telling people that we no longer, I hope, but I don't take yes for an answer. But the reason that's important is you've been able to talk to legislators about limiting things like tanning beds. Melanoma in young women now is on fire. Yeah There are ways that we can prevent it. There are ways that we can do it. The reason I bring this all up is in some of your writing and comedy, you talk about being pale, which I love. I think pale is the new cool. That is the cool. I think people have to understand the pale is what saves lives. I think we've got something here. I call it the valor of pallor. I also call it cadaver sheik, but I just started I'm so pale and I have so many moles. You can see. Yeah. That the only way is to just lean into it, because I would look ridiculous with Bronzer like, our ex-president. I just feel like you have to embrace who you are and don't try follow that. But we know now for years, for over decades, we've been marketing indoor tanning beds, UVA lighting to prom students, high school, children who are teenagers. Well, you know what? It was the stuff that took on the natural landscape of our lives. We didn't really understand. But we know now that, if you're going to do that, you should be an adult, if you're really are going to do it, but certainly we shouldn't be marketing to children to get jump into a tanning bed. I love your message and we're so grateful for your work. Thank you so much, Bill, and thank you for having me. I am really honored. Well, when this comes out, we will certainly share it with you and thanks for being here. Thank you Bill have a great day Good to see you ma'am. Thanks so much. Bye, bye.
